CTF Game 4 - Turn 8 Please VOTE for MVP

Post by **M0rtimer** » Sat Jun 13, 2015 1:14 pm

Oh, the rolling was fair- It was just that I was confused and it might indeed just be better to have one color always take the lower side of the roll rather than anything conditional.

Krulle · Post by **Krulle** » Sat Jun 13, 2015 2:22 pm

Wears introduced that, and Nerre took over that..

Post by **M0rtimer** » Sat Jun 13, 2015 3:32 pm

Actually, Wears mechanic was to have the lower side of the rolls always on one side- Not based on who "attacks".

Krulle · Post by **Krulle** » Sun Jun 14, 2015 1:40 am

Bit then, the comments on coyoterolls show that he decided beforehand who gets what....
As long as it's consequent, I don't care...
But it feels good to be on the sunny side of the dice... :)

Nerre · Post by **Nerre** » Sun Jun 14, 2015 2:19 pm

Now it is Red 1-10 blue 11-20 plusminus bonuses. Already wrote it some posts ago.

Thats the same order than on the field, where red is left (which equals lower numbers for me) and blue on the right.

I will update now. Bahamut did not post, but I got captain's orders for him.

Nerre · Post by **Nerre** » Sun Jun 14, 2015 3:15 pm

After the large match, some of the clan members wander off the field to rest, while others cannot get enough of this game, so the decide to hold another training game, although a bit smaller this time.

Turn 7

In the first half, Yells respawn on A1.
No Name guards B2, trying to stop charger from advancing the easiest way with the flag.
Dreamer and Stands use the opportunity to advance,which earns Dreamer 1 xp.
This leaves us with the exiting duell between Bomb and Charger. Will Bomb stop the flag stealer, or will he get away and be one step closer to score for his team?

► Show Spoiler

Despite Bombs best efforts, Charger escapes with the flag, ending up on A1 with Yells.
He scores 1 xp and 1 point for his team. Why are those dice so one-sided, really? The spectators start to get bored.

red-blue 2-8

In the second half, Stands earns some easy advancement xp by running to C3. Nobody seems to care for him, while Charger got the red flag. Charger meanwhile waves at Yells while he runs past him with the red flag, as the strategist doesn't seem to have expected this move, cause he cheers for No Name instead of guarding.
Bomb angrily runs to B2, trying to stay in interception range of Charger.
No Name and Dreamer tackle against each other, one from B2 to B3, one the other way around.

► Show Spoiler

This time, the dice are clearly on the red team's side. No Name overwhelms Dreamer and both end up in B3. Dreamer gets pinned down by No Name and has to respawn as first action next turn, while No Name earned himself 2 xp and 1 point for the red team. Yells also gets 1 xp for cheering, which cheers up his mood slightly after letting Charger slip through.
This also brings No Name into a better position for an interception next turn.

red-blue 3-8

Rules and signups

Discuss all your tactics inside the team, then pm me with the final moves. Please don't copy me in for all messages, as I don't want to get confused or make mistakes cause moves are taken back or changed. Better for the sake of the game. I'll update when everyone (myself included) is ready.

If you find any mistakes in the game math or picture tell me, I will try to fix it.

The game ends on 12 points.

► Show Spoiler

ChuckDaRighteous · Post by **ChuckDaRighteous** » Sun Jun 14, 2015 4:15 pm

Not that it matters but you forgot distance traveled on tackle bonuses. So Dreamer should have +4 and Mort should have +2.

Post by **WearsHats** » Sun Jun 14, 2015 9:40 pm

No Name gets two points. One for winning the tussle, one for sending Dreamer back.

Post by **SeeAMoose** » Mon Jun 15, 2015 3:19 am

2 xp, not 2 points.

Krulle · Post by **Krulle** » Mon Jun 15, 2015 3:28 am

Also, Dreamer does not get advancement XP, as the flag capture has not been completed yet, therefore I can get only one advancement XP if I can reach the first column....

And Charger still has his three XP for successful capture, which have been given premature.... (We're working on gaining them according to the intention)

With the roll, you forgot to give tackle bonuses (+4 Dreamer, +2 Has No Name). (as Chuck pointed out)
Has No Name gets two XP, not just one (he's sending me/Dreamer back).

Nerre · Post by **Nerre** » Mon Jun 15, 2015 3:54 am

I have edited it, Charger is now back on 6 xp instead of 9 until he reaches his half with the flag (or not).

About No Name points: It was correct already right when the update was posted: "No Name earned himself 2 xp and 1 point for the red team". He had 3 xp last turn, and now he has 5 xp. 2 xp and 1 team point.

Post by **WearsHats** » Mon Jun 15, 2015 3:55 am

SeeAMoose wrote:2 xp, not 2 points.

Oh, right. Don't mind me. Have not slept nearly enough this weekend. .

Nerre · Post by **Nerre** » Mon Jun 15, 2015 3:56 am

nervermind, did not have much sleep either.

Krulle · Post by **Krulle** » Mon Jun 15, 2015 4:35 am

Yeah, freshly married does that to anyone. *wink, wink*

Not much sleep either, but it's a direct result of not having much sleep after I got married... :p

But this packs out interesting: Anytime I get tackled on their side, I lose. It annoys me that I cannot help Charger to carry the flag back, and that he alone gets the capture XP, as end of next turn he'll be back... yes, that's my greed speaking

In turn 7-1 I still get one advancement XP, which is wrong.

the rules wrote:- Experience
In practise matches, players get:
1xp for winning a tussle

1xp for sending an opponent back to their back row

3xp for participating in a successful flag capture

1xp for each row into the opponents side they advance. The maximum row reached is reset when/if the opponent flag is successfully captured.

1xp for being on the winning team.

(bold, underlign, italic done by me to highlight why I don't get advancement XP - I have reached two columns, so I have received 2XP, but no reset has happened yet - so it remains at two until I can reach their home column.)

Q (at the more experienced players from previous forums (Moose, Wears, ...): If the flag gets sent back next turn by a successful capture by Charger, that means the rows get reset for Stands Firm too. If he were to forward to A1 (three advancement XP until this turn) this turn, and the flag reset next turn, does that mean he immediately gets another three, or will he have to return to his own field side first for the reset to effectuate? - Just asking... (he did not advance, so that might be my answer, but moving one back and one forward again is a lot easier than going all the way back and forward again).

[Edit] Nevermind. If the flag capture is successful this turn, we get another 5 points and we're done. [/Edit]

Nerre · Post by **Nerre** » Tue Jun 16, 2015 8:03 am

After the large match, some of the clan members wander off the field to rest, while others cannot get enough of this game, so the decide to hold another training game, although a bit smaller this time.

Turn 8
In the first half, Dreamer respawns on B6.
No Name and Bomb both try to intercept Charger by tackling into the most obvious path he might take, which means Bomb tackles into A2, No Name into A3. Yells cheers for Bomb, as he got fewer bonuses to apply.
As Bomb tackles to A2, he sees to his surprise that Charger is sprinting towards him. Seems Charger prefers one 100% chance to face one enemy to two 50% chances. Bomb tries to intercept him.

► Show Spoiler

The dice seem to really, really not like the red team. With chances looking pretty good for Bomb, he still does not manage to get a hold on Charger. Again Charger earns 1 xp and 1 point for his team. No Name curses for two reason, as his tackle into A3 ends with him landing on the ground without an enemy. He has to deal with a -1 penalty next turn. If there is a next turn.
Stands meanwhile moves to B3 to provide some cover for Charger.

red-blue 3-9

In the second half, the red team cannot do anything about Charger ending his sprint. Yells cheers for No Name, but No Name cannot attack.
Dreamer tackles the empty B5 for some reason, but gets no penalty thanks to his skills.
Stands meanwhile runs to B2, earning himself 1 xp for advancing.
Charger brings home the flag, happily waving it over his head once he reaches his own half.
He scores 5 points for his team and 3 xp for the flag capture. Dreamer and Stands also get 3 xp for the flag run, even if they only acted as cannon fodder.

The blue team clearly won, which means one more xp for Dreamer, Stands and Charger.

Please send me your votes for the MVP.

I hope you liked the game, even with the one sided behaviour of the dice.

red-blue 3-14

Rules and signups

Discuss all your tactics inside the team, then pm me with the final moves. Please don't copy me in for all messages, as I don't want to get confused or make mistakes cause moves are taken back or changed. Better for the sake of the game. I'll update when everyone (myself included) is ready.

If you find any mistakes in the game math or picture tell me, I will try to fix it.

The game ends on 12 points.

► Show Spoiler

ChuckDaRighteous · Post by **ChuckDaRighteous** » Tue Jun 16, 2015 9:05 am

Not that it matters but sprint awareness means I should have suffered 1 less penalty. But then I shouldn't of had the dodge bonus because flag carriers lose bonuses.

MVP vote: Stands for being lvl 2 and still holding his own vs the big dogs.

Krulle · Post by **Krulle** » Tue Jun 16, 2015 9:18 am

Stands Firm, as he won quite some important tussles against big dogs.
Righteous Charger as captain deserves it too,

also, I think you copied too mch wrong text over...
Righteous Charger was on 6 XP, now he added one tussle, 3XP for flag capture, and 1XP for winning. 6+5 does, in my math (nach Adam Riese), not make 14....

I will have to look that up later, 5XP for Stands sounds too low.... (3 for flag, 1 for winning,.... and he sent someone home at least once, that alone makes 6XP)

Nerre · Post by **Nerre** » Tue Jun 16, 2015 11:12 am

ChuckDaRighteous wrote:Not that it matters but sprint awareness means I should have suffered 1 less penalty. But then I shouldn't of had the dodge bonus because flag carriers lose bonuses.

The flag carrier explanation says you lose all skill and feat bonuses, which includes sprint awareness. You only get the bonuses from your class levels, which was the 5% to dodge cause of attacker 1. I don't see a mistake here, especially after I read it multiple times to be sure this time.

I corrected the XP, had a calculation mistake in the flag capture xp. Somehow I added not enough xp for some and too much for others.

Nerre · Post by **Nerre** » Tue Jun 16, 2015 11:16 am

PS: Some talked about doing something about uneven gaining of xp, to avoid some getting almost none while others earn a lot. The average xp in this game would be 6,33 per player. All members of the red team are below that, cause the very one sided dice results.

Do you want to raise everybody to 6 or 7 xp at least, or do you want to leave it as it is?

(And do I get xp for my char? There were several ideas, like 3 xp, average xp rounded up, and some more.)

Post by **M0rtimer** » Tue Jun 16, 2015 11:45 am

Can we vote for the dice?

Because really, fuck the dice.

Don't have a strong opinion on the whole xp balancing though. Shit happens. Have the majority decide on what should happen.

Krulle · Post by **Krulle** » Tue Jun 16, 2015 1:15 pm

Voting for the dice is at discretion of the GM.
But be aware, if the dice levels, a lot of the calculations won't make sense anymore. A D21 would, in a fight without modifiers, mean that a thrown 11 means tie. What then? Both lost their tussle? Both won their tussle?

Against balancing of XP.
Shit happens (seldom as extreme as now). Last game I was on the unlucky side, although in the end the points were near even...

XP for GM: average of players for the whole game ( yours would then be round(41/6=6,83)=7 ). It was done like that in the previous games...
(btw: I calculate an average of 6,83 XP per player... )

Nerre · Post by **Nerre** » Tue Jun 16, 2015 2:40 pm

yes, calculated the other value from the old numbers before correcting them, as I did not look it up here but in my files...were the xp was still lower.

ChuckDaRighteous · Post by **ChuckDaRighteous** » Tue Jun 16, 2015 3:38 pm

Nerre wrote:
ChuckDaRighteous wrote:Not that it matters but sprint awareness means I should have suffered 1 less penalty. But then I shouldn't of had the dodge bonus because flag carriers lose bonuses.
The flag carrier explanation says you lose all skill and feat bonuses, which includes sprint awareness. You only get the bonuses from your class levels, which was the 5% to dodge cause of attacker 1. I don't see a mistake here, especially after I read it multiple times to be sure this time.

Matter of interpretation. I considered sprint awareness as removal of a penalty not a bonus and considered the dodge bonus to be part of the "skills" when interpreting it as a bonus. Either way it doesn't matter.

Krulle · Post by **Krulle** » Wed Jun 17, 2015 12:25 am

I have to change my MVP vote to Righteous Charger.
He did not loose a single dice roll. And all of the tussle were on enemy territory...
And he was captain.
And he brought the flag against all odds home. (For certain definitions of home.)

So now we have:
Stands Firm: 1 (ChuckDaRighteous)
Righteous Charger: 1 (Krulle)
Dice: 1 (M0rtimer)

► Show Spoiler

Post by **Theis2** » Wed Jun 17, 2015 1:29 am

I'm going to vote for the one sided dice as well

Stands Firm: 1 (ChuckDaRighteous)
Righteous Charger: 1 (Krulle)
Dice: 2 (M0rtimer, Theis2)

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